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INTRODUCTION
Greetings, and welcome to my first stab at
a regular column/article. I guess I shall begin by
explaining the intentions of this "thing".
Noise Pollution asked me to do a column that was a
bit of an education on influential bands, labels...or
whatever I deem worthy of my time and
limited writing abilities. This is pretty much what
I intend to do. However, most of what I will be putting
on here will be what I think this town (and beyond)
needs to remember or know about when it comes to the
underground-punk-indie scene. Of course, this is only
one man's opinion. Louisville's youth has a long history
of xenophobia (which, in some cases, was an artistic
advantage); but as anybody knows, pretty much every
and any existing band in this town would not be doing
what they are doing had it not been for countless
bands and artists who paved the way years ago. You
don't have to like all of the bands, labels, or genres
I
mention, interview, discuss, or ramble endlessly and
aimlessly about. Hell, I might not even like them
all. But this craft which we call "punk rock"
was shaped by many hands, many that deserve much respect
and none of which should be forgotten. I guess what
I am trying to say is that this column will be meant
to just give some artists the respect they deserve...and
hopefully open a few minds. Good enough? I will try
and keep my personal dislikes on the low-down. I want
this to be a good natured, respectful...informative(?)
thing. It'll be good therapy for my inner-asshole
that erupts so often when discussing the local scene
and such. Most of all: I AM NOT A WRITER, so this
will be a very simple look at these subjects. Maybe
it will be respected on that level...or not. I am
not going in any list of priority, favorites...or
whatever. But, I suppose the first one is sort of
a landmark. In fact, it has been keeping me up quite
a bit- deliberating on a subject that I would want
to start
this thing with.
So, after long deliberation, the first band I have
decided to talk about is Saccharine Trust. A personal
favorite of mine, and an often overlooked SST great...ST
continues to rock today (after a long hiatus). I had
the great pleasure of interviewing Joe Baiza a couple
of years ago
for a zine that never happened. So...it will make
me happy to use it somewhere.
Let's get this thing started. Thank you for your time
and attention.
WE BECAME SNAKES
When looking back upon early punk bands, you will
find few as talented and overlooked as Saccharine
Trust. Hailing from the L.A. area, ST was primarily
active from 1980-'86 (before reforming again in 1996).
At the heart of the band was vocalist Jack Brewer
and guitarist Joe Baiza, who together made a merciless
sound that mixed psychedelic-jazz-mess-punk
with beat-style poetry. Awesome stuff. Saccharine
was sometimes compared to The Doors, if you can ever
imagine a "punk" band ever being accused
of such a thing. But, the comparisons are understandable
when listening to Brewers poetic lyrics and Baiza's
jazz and 60's rock influenced guitar.
Joe Baiza didn't even begin playing guitar until he
was 27, in 1979. As Mike Watt said of Baiza- "Joe
is proof that you're never too young to start playing
punk rock." I am trying to go lite on the info
since I had the wonderful pleasure of interviewing
Joe back in 1998 on one of Mike Watt's "Contemplating
the Engine Room" tours. He tells much of the
band's history, and offers some of his insights on
music in general.
The album Mike Watt album, "Contemplating the
Engine Room", was recorded with Nels Cline on
guitar, but he was unavailable for 6-string duties
when touring time came. So, Watt asked his old friend
Baiza to fill in...and with wonderful results. Joe
did his thing on it and it was amazing to watch.
So...here is a brief interview with Joe...and I get
off easy on my first column. Ha.
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William Benton: So how long have you been playing
guitar?
Joe Baiza: Let me think...I started playing the guitar
in '79.
WB: And when did Saccharine Trust form?
JB: Well, that's when I started playing the guitar!
Jack and I...well, I met Jack (Brewer) and he had
a band before that. He asked me to play the bass for
about a month. I was into punk rock and Jack wasn't
really into it. But then I tried t introduce him to
the punk scene and little by little, Jack started
to warm up to it and he kinda' wanted to have a punk
band. The guys in his band decided to quit; they didn't
like that idea. So then...well, Jack was playing guitar
at the time, and I was playing the bass. So, I said
"Why don't we start a band, and you'll be the
singer and I'll be the guitar player?" And he
liked that idea! (laughs) Because
I wanted to play guitar, and I was always thinking
"How am I going to get him away from the guitar?
Ah! I'll tell him to be the singer, ya' know?
WB: Ya' can't turn down that opportunity, ehh?
JB: Yeah! (laughs) So that's when I started to play
the guitar. Before that, I wasn't playing at all.
Well...maybe I knew a few little chords or something.
WB: Were there any specific punk bands of the time
that time that inspired you to start your own band?
JB: Yeah, the L.A. punk bands I was checking out
were the Germs; I really liked them a lot...and X
back then. A band called The Screamers...I really
liked them a lot...and a few other ones that I don't
remember now. I was just listening to the bands in
Los Angeles because I wouldn't buy any records; I
would just go out, and whoever was playing I would
hear them, ya' know?
WB: Do you remember much about the very first show
you played?
JB: Yeah, I do...Mike (Watt) was who got us the show.
He had the Minutemen and they had already done some
shows while Saccharine Trust was still kind of struggling
along; we went along for about a year, trying to find
a drummer and a bass player...no one wanted to play
with us...and finally we got these guys from (San)
Pedro to play with us; Rich and Lewis. And we were
practicing...and then Mike called us up and said (in
surley Watt voice) "Yeah, we got this gig at
a party, ya' know? And we need a band to open up.
You guys wanna' do it?" And I said "Well,
I don't think we're ready yet". He was like "Oh
you big chicken! You're never gonna'be ready!!!"
As he kinda' pressured me into it...
WB: A little tough love, huh?
JB: Yeah...kinda' confrontational kind of..."You're
never going to play! You guys...". So, eventually
I was "All right! We'll do it!!!" So...then
we did the gig. It was a party...and I remember being
really nervous. And I couldn't see very well; it ws
in a back yard, and it was only by candlelight. Just
candles. Then, the Minutemen played. No...they played
second...or...yeah, we played second.
WB: When and how did you get acquainted with Mike
Watt?
JB: I met him through D. Boon. I moved into this
apartment in San Pedro, into a friend's apartment...he
let me live in his living room. Around that time I
was starting Saccharine Trust with Jack. I heard some
guy upstairs working on The Who's "Pinball Wizard",
ya' know? I was really into punk rock, and I was thinking
"Who's this rock'n'roll guy upstairs? Rock'n'roll
sucks. Fuck that. I'm into punk rock." So, I
didn't really know who it was. So, one day we were
working on one of our songs. Jack and I had these
tiny little amplifiers, and that was all we had; it
was just guitar and vocals. And...someone knocked
on the door, and I thought that it was probably the
landlord complaining. So, I was like "Uh-oh",
and I opened the door and there's this kinda' chubby
guy with an army coat and a PIL button...and his hair
was a little bit long. I thought "Who's this
hippie? What??? A PIL button???" And he goes
"Hi", and he's real nice and everything.
So, I was talking to him, asking how it was going
and everything...and we talked some more, and it turns
out that he was in this band called the Reactionaries.
That was the band that Mike, Dennes, and George (Hurley)
had before the Minutemen. And I had seen the Reactionaries
before at another party before in Long Beach, so I
got real excited; "Whoa! You were in the Reactionaries?
Come on inside!". So, we just talked about music
and stuff and got along really well. So, I met D.
Boon that way. He said that he was starting a band
with this guy Mike Watt.
Sometimes I'd hear them working on their songs, just
bass and guitar...and we'd be working on our stuff.
And I met Mike later. I saw either their first or
second gig. I don't recall now. I just thought that
they were a really good band when I heard them.
WB: So do you have any other projects going on right
now?
JB: Yeah. I have the Mecolodiacs. That's kind of
an off-shoot from Universal Congress Of; kinda' a
punk-jazz band or something. We played a kind of music
that we called "mecolodics"; an off-shoot
from "harmolodics" which is a musical concept
that Ornette Coleman...the saxophone player...created.
It had a lot of relation to collective improvisation.
So we, coming from punk rock, decided to kind of incorporate
that into our songs. So we called it "mecolodics".
Universal Congress Of...we'd do jazz songs, but fast,
or kind of fucked up. Or we'd do a funk song but kind
of strange. It was a common thread to us...all
this stuff. I used to go over and tour a lot in Europe
with Universal Congress Of in the early 90's. Then
I broke the band up, and kinda' worked on some other
projects. Then I got the Mecolodiacs going. With the
original bass player and drummer; it's a trio. We
recorded in Germany in February of this year (1998),
and we plan to return to tour in August.
WB: Are you like Watt, in the sense that you prefer
the three-piece?
JB: Yeah, I actually do like the trio; it's a real
challenge. I view it as a tripod or a stool with three
legs. Each leg has to be strong, otherwise it'll fall,
ya' know? A quartet, or those other things are nice,
but if one leg is weak, it'll still hold up. But with
the trio...there's just something about it. Each three,
they have to be their own; very strong; keeps it a
challenge to hold up that way. That's what I like
having the trio; each guy has to hold his own. And
if you want to add another voice or something, it's
cool. But we're always strong as three. And I like
doing this trio with Mike.
WB: The last time I saw "The Opera", it
had Stephen Hodges (percussionist for Tom Waits) on
drums. Now you have Bob Lee. So what's Hodges doing?
JB: Well, he's got another job; I hear that he got
a gig with the Smashing Pumpkins.
WB: Really? Weird.
JB: Yeah. He got a gig with them. I think they have
a couple of percussionists. Not quite sure. So, he
went to do that, and now we have Bob Lee. He's played
with Clawhammer, Crawlspace, and Backbiter. I think
Clawhammer is the only one that really tours around
the U.S. Bob and I also had a project in LA called
Nastassya Filippovna, and that was a noise band. It
was a trio, but Mike would sit in with us from time
to time. We had two basses, drums, and guitar. It
was just free-form sounds, ya' know? We did some recordings,
but they are just sitting there, waiting to be put
out, ya' know? But yeah, we've all jammed around
together in Los Angeles before; even Steve Reed (soundman
for Mike Watt's "Contemplating the Engine Room"
tours) plays in a band that I've jammed with. Bob's
played with the Mecolodiacs a few times. We're all
kinda' tied in somehow.
WB: Have you seen any bands lately that blew you
away?
JB: Let's see...well, I am ashamed to say that I
don't really keep track of new groups. The only way
I find out about new bands is through friends, or
people I meet....or if I'm doing a gig and somebody's
opening up. I did like this band from DC, called Cranium
that we played with. They have this kind of fragmented
sound. I thought that they were cool. Then, a friend
of mine in Richmond, he has a band called...uhh...(pause)
what the fuck's their name? (long pause) Uh-oh. Well....(laughs)
WB: So much for the plug, ehh?
JB: Yeah, really! (laughs) No wait! It's Mau Sey
Helen(sp?)...like Mau Say Tung(sp?)? Actually, he
is the bass player that used to be in the Alter Natives
years ago. I thought that they were really interesting.
I saw them for the first time on this tour. Very...strange.
(chuckles) Every once in a while you run into some
cool bands.
---------------------------------------------------
Joe Baiza's other bands, Universal Congress Of and
the Mecolodiacs both have awesome releases on Enemy
Records. (The debut Universal Congress Of release
was on SST.) Saccharine Trust have been playing fairly
steadily around the LA area for about seven years
now. They recorded an album in 2001 on Hazelwood Records
(of Germany) entitled "The Great One is Dead".
It is still awaiting a domestic release in the states.
This is great news for a band that had, and has so
much more to offer a music lover than the more popular
punk rock bands of their time...or any time.
Many thanks to Joe Baiza for the interview, and for
the inspiration.
www.saccharinetrust.com |
